Dylan (01:40):

To give everybody a little background of yourself, kind of how you got started in this. Everybody has some kind of context here.

Eric (01:45):

Yeah, absolutely. So I've been advertising for the better part of almost five years. And I'd like to say on Facebook exclusively for since about 2016, mid 2016. And I started when I had like my first brand and then I did that for a while. Um, and then I got really lucky. I was able to sell that one on and that was a streetwear company. Um, only to start another one, two months later. And then I did that. Um, and I sold that one and I just wanted to take a break. It was, you know, early 2019 I wanted to take a break and then I got right back into it and I realized I'm not really a huge product person, but I really love advertising things. And I think that's the only reason I saw any amount of success. Not that the product was great, um, because we were able to sell it and advertise it well.

Eric (02:32):

So I started taking on clients and then I also took over as head of e-commerce and digital strategy for a naked Wolf, which is a, uh, streetwear high fashion footwear brand. Um, specifically women's sneakers more than anything. And that was a really, really cool learning experience. And then, um, you know, I think up until June or July this year, I decided to leave and pursue advertising for my clients full time and kind giving them my undivided attention. Um, and you know, it's been really fun. Um, now I think the main focus is really just expanding the company, but simultaneously just giving the current clients I have the best service imaginable. Um, cause I think that that always does come first

Dylan (03:15):

Without a doubt. I mean, and that's what keeps the retention up is that kind of white glove service these days. So, I mean, it sounds like you're perfect on track there, but it's kind of cool. You started with your own brand. A lot of advertisers we know came in through an agency too, or you just kind of test it on yourself with your own budget. So, I mean, that's super one-off and bad-ass

Eric (03:34):

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think a lot of media buyers, especially at these agencies, they kind of go to college and they study marketing and you know, that's cool. It was definitely cool. Especially like 20 years ago when, um, the syllabus was on time, but now, you know, they're kind of leaving, they're joining these advertising companies and they're managing big accounts and you know, that's okay if they can do it well, but I think there's no better experience than practice and you know, what makes better practice and putting your own money on the line doing so, um, hell yeah. You know,

Dylan (04:06):

Dow, I think I boosted my first post in college for our hockey team cause like we're in Texas and no one knew about hockey and I kind of fell into it with a random gig at Facebook with a random employment on indeed. So I mean, it's, it's interesting how all these individuals kind of come into this advertising world, but man, that's, that's a bad-ass story there.

Eric (04:25):

Yeah. Um, well it's funny, I've really, um, you know, the first advertisement I don't, I don't even call it an advertisement. I did boosted posts for about that was all I had in 2013. Um, and it wasn't even my content and you know, like there was this big thing on Facebook where there's like reposting videos and one of those pages. Um, so I think it was a video of some guy like freaking out in a subway and um, I just downloaded the video and posted it. And I said like my page for more videos, I gave it 10 bucks and ads were really not competitive back then. So it got a lot of traction very quickly. Um, and yeah, I think that was like the first advertisement per se. And there was no target and no nothing, but it did what I needed to do. Oh man,

Dylan (05:13):

Reach back in the day was unreal till, I mean, it's so much, but heck yeah man. So I know we're going to be diving into one of your client's ads. It's it's, you know, you've been with them for a while. I'm kind of pumped to dive into this one cause I got some questions on it for sure. But go everybody, go ahead and give everybody kind of a little backstory on it. And just so everybody's aware, this will be in the show notes, so we'll have a screenshot of the ad for reference, um, but kind of break it down for us and you know how to do [inaudible].

Eric (05:44):

Yeah, absolutely. So this is for my client NuGo order and they're um, uh, women's um, I'd say mid-market fashion brand, um, you know, one of my favorite clients actually, and they work on like seasonal drops, kind of like how street wear brands do it. So for example, um, earlier this year they had a hello kitty campaign. They actually collaborated with hello kitty and it did extremely well. And now this one it's called Camden and Camden is just a little a subsect of London, which is where new girl order is based to space in London. Um, so this collection was almost a polar opposite of hello, kitty. Hello, kitty was, you know, really bright color kind of friendly and inclusive. And then it, Camden was really like a bad kind of brand. So I was like, man, I don't know how this is going to work because we've just been giving it two months of hello, kitty fans on the Facebook pixel.

Eric (06:34):

But nonetheless it did really, really well. It got the same CP. In fact, I think he got a little better CPA, um, than the hello kitty campaign. And the cool thing about this is there wasn't a clear CTA. If I kind of watched the ad, like it takes me a little while to, if I was a brand new customer, like, wait, what is this? You know? Um, but then I think if you have a brain solid, you'll realize, Oh, this is clothing, uh, or this is fashion. Um, and that's the, that's the kind of thing with like fashion and luxury brands. I know with a lot of these like utility based products, you have to make clearer, this is toothpaste. Um, this is a drink, this is a work from home, sweat pants, which look like, you know, with fashion, it's not like that.

Eric (07:18):

You're really just selling a creative image. You're really just selling a brand and then people will catch on and um, they'll make the purchase. So with the Camden video, uh, man, I wish I was on the set, but it was, I saw it. It was absolutely crazy. And it w they kind of filmed it like how they're filming a TV commercial almost. And you know, a lot of things that media buyers say is, Oh, you know, TV, commercial content doesn't work. You just have to film it on your living room with a 2007 Android phone. And people love it. And maybe that's the case if you're sounding like a crappy product with like a $20 AOV. But I think when he was selling fashion, you really have to sell the brand and you have to have cool content, you know, UGC is absolutely great, but it doesn't work all the time. Um, and it doesn't work in luxury, um, for sure,

Dylan (08:06):

Big time people, you know, and it's luxury, they're paying top dollar. So if you're at, creative's not top dollar, they can realize that really quick. I feel like, yeah, absolutely. And, and, you know,

Eric (08:15):

Like this, this ad for new order, I was like, it would be great for a brand awareness campaign. Cause it's just like a video. Um, and you can kind of get some engagement off at bar. Our goal was really to get some conversions. Um, so with obviously some tips and tricks in the, um, bending strategy, it still comes down to the content. So it was really happy to find out that that was like one of the best ads we've done. And, um, I think we're kind of, I hope we kind of go more into that, that type of creative in the future, obviously it's at the discretion of the creative director and what have you, but I think that did extremely well and I'd love for that kind of stuff to continue. Um, and it was a really, really cool collection. That is one I'm definitely proud of.

Dylan (08:58):

Now when it comes to the ad itself, can you share how the kind of study results were? Was it able to be kind of a row as you know, examples? Was it X three X, two X more? Is that kind of something you can kind of speak on?

Eric (09:12):

Yeah, absolutely. So this is a prospecting ad. I don't really, I didn't want to put it on a bottom of the funnel because you're following the, we posted it organically on Instagram as well, which I think is worth mentioning. Um, but we posted it later. So this is a prospecting audience and it was, you know, we use lookalikes, we used, uh, interests and then we separated the interest. So there was no overlap and detailed targeting expansion, all that stuff was turned off. Um, so we did that and we were getting about a four to five pound, which is, I think six bucks, six bucks, 20 CPA on the purchase event. And then the row was just above five. Um, the campaign isn't that old, but also it's a campaign. So it's not going to be around in a couple of weeks anyway. Um, which is why it's really important, especially in fashion, you know, you cannot just have this ad running for two months and change the copy and stuff. You don't have time in a month. It's gone. Yeah. But yeah, that's just one of the challenges we have, but I think it was good. Um, the prospecting for a prospecting audience, I think a five X is really good.

Dylan (10:17):

Oh yeah, man. I think somebody could put in a dollar and get five Alfred cold audiences that's dump fuel the fire man.

Eric (10:25):

I was like really happy with that. Um, you know, as, especially for something and I mean, it's not like fast fashion, fast fashion, you're selling stuff for like 10 20 bucks. This, this isn't that. Yeah. Um, you know, this is at least 40, 40 something bucks on average

Dylan (10:39):

Now in the copy, the, the, the first thing I noticed was it's kind of like crazy font English font is, have you ever, I've personally never done this before. Cause I'm always like worried about policy and stuff, but no issues, not a single issue. Boom, boom,

Eric (10:56):

No issues. Um, you know, we, we do post these things a lot. Like we know when the collection is going to drop, so we'll post it two, three days early, something goes wrong, we'll fix it and then we'll publish it later. But uh, no, the old English pawn went through and I don't think it should really be a problem. Um, funnily enough, policy violation, wasn't something I was expecting. If there was going to be one, I'd be like, okay, this video, but no, uh, I'll get,

Dylan (11:22):

Yeah. And I mean, the copy is just so simple shop the new collection now. I mean, it's the creative speaks for itself in this scenario. I mean, they got the crazy hair looking at the camera, the pop and lips. I mean, that's some stopping power right there without a doubt. Yeah.

Eric (11:37):

You know, you start to look at your audience, you know, they're typically women who like buying clothes and they have a little more of an executive and a little more of an eccentric taste than most. Um, so you don't want to, like, I don't want to tell them, uh, free delivery if you spend over this or ships within X amount of days, um, God, they did. They're not gonna give a. Let's be real. Look on the website and find out the delivery. Cause then I can retarget you if you don't buy it. Um, um, but you know, stuff like that, um, you know, the collection is called Camden, click it to check it out. Um, I really just wanted to divert the attention to the video. I don't think it has that curiosity aspect to it that just reels people in. So that CTR had to have been the main, it was, you know, CTR is actually one of those metrics I don't really look at because I just think it's not that important.

Eric (12:28):

I know we have this discussion, you have five metrics. Um, you know, I look at the cost, I look at the value, I look at the row and I look at the CPA. Nothing else matters to me. Oh, you're spot on. And I mean, everybody, it could just have a very click baity ad. That's just, people want to click that. See more. So, I mean, it doesn't judge sales by any means at all. It's just, it's a glamour metric, you know, it's, it's one of those ones that flex on that shouldn't need flex. And it's the same thing as conversion rate. You know what I mean? Like you can spend hours and hours and hours making your site so refined. But if the Facebook algorithm decides to send you traffic, you know, you're wondering, what did I do wrong? Well, the answer is nothing besides think about conversion rate.

Eric (13:09):

Yeah, yeah. No, what I mean, you're spot on there and I mean, that's quite a rich ad though. Five X on cold audiences, straight fire man. So of course my favorite clients, man, they have such a good, it's not just the ad. Their product market fit is insane. I mean, yeah, at night it makes it nice when they have a creative director and a creative team involved to really go above and beyond to kind of really create converting content I should should say, Oh yeah, dude. I know Lauren who runs our, um, social media and content. Um, God like top two or top three in the game. Hell yeah.

Zach (13:47):

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Eric (15:07):

Well, everybody, that's quite a rich ad as mentioned. We'll pop this bad boy in the show notes and we're going to move into this poor ad segment and we got it's, it's quite shocking. Um, it's uh, we're gonna go ahead and shut the brand out body candy, body jewelry, um, happy hump day shop our new jewelry here. And the image is atrocious. I can't tell if it's a blueberry or similar frosting on there, but it's w w hashtag tongue piercing live, you know,

Eric (15:43):

First of all, let's get something out of the way that that image is fine. Dumb. I'm not going to go for the whole thing of an advertisement is good because it catches your attention. It doesn't really matter if it makes me feel sick. Um, you know, you're selling body jewelry. And then in the same image, you're telling people that a tongue piercing is a huge inconvenience. Like, first of all, if I hated myself enough to get a tongue piercing, I don't want to be reminded of the inconveniences that has, um, you know, and also it's just a weird image, you know, it's, it took me a minute to understand until I read that hashtag, I was like, I can't see why there's a line. And I'm like, Oh, she was looking at the top of that cupcake. And that's what caused that line. Was it sung piercing? Like I scream like that. I don't think people really, you know, kind of bite more than anything. I feel pretty gross. Yeah. It was just weird. And like, again, I had to read the caption to figure out what the image was, which I think is bad. Oh. And the best part is, is their landing page goes to belly button rings.

Eric (16:50):

I don't know where you're putting the ice cream, but God it's dumb, man. And it's crazy cause it's not coming from like some idiot brand. Like they clearly have a lot of Instagram followers and a huge Facebook. One of the only brands I know, which is a huge Facebook page and an okay Instagram. I have a million Facebook likes and half a million Instagram likes follows either. They should be doing better. They should not. That's that's odd, creative, further demographic, without a doubt. I'm personally not a fan of having the link like that and the copy with no CTA or a headline at the bottom. Personally, everybody has their own ways, but I mean, this ad is just, it's just not native looking at all and it's kind of gross. Well, I don't understand why you'd ever put the link in the copy if you're putting it on Instagram and Facebook, if you're putting the link in the copy, put it on Facebook, but don't put it on Instagram. It looks dumb. I can't even click it by the way. Exactly. Um, and there's like a big button at the bottom of the image saying shop now, like, you know, use that text and use it as like little real estate. Instagram gives you to say something and when that's your image, gotta be saying a lot because I was like no way from reporting that ad. Cause I thought it was something very different.

Dylan (18:06):

Awesome. Yeah. There's some guys who can get away with some lucrative stuff, but that's quite a poor ad. That's a trash ad.

Eric (18:13):

Yeah. Great cloaking attempts. But no, it was just a creative, well,

Dylan (18:19):

Oh, man. We'll go ahead and waive those two segments out of the way. So of course the final piece of the pie in these scenarios, we live to take a page out of the rich dad, poor dad book, you know, give some sort of financial principles, some sort of tips out there. You know, as mentioned, we've spoken about scaling, using points for Bitcoin, um, setting up partnerships with clients influencers. So we have a wide array of, you know, our audience of media buyers, businesses agencies. So I mean, based on your experience, kind of what you're getting into, what are some financial tips? You kind of give somebody in your situation, whether it's coming up with budget, scaling all over the place, but what kind of financial tips would you kind of throw?

Eric (18:57):

Yeah. Well, I think if you're working for e-commerce brands, you really need to just really, you need to come to the acceptance that the return on ad spend needs to be a lot higher for them to get, you know, a better bottom line. That's just how it goes. You can get one to two X, um, you know, on an app install and you know, you're, you're all good. But if you're spending, especially if you're spending on a lower budget, you're getting a two to three X return. Sometimes it's just not enough. You have to accept that some brands just need a five, six, seven, maybe a Forex to become really profitable and you have to work really hard to get that. Um, but you should also talk with your client and figure out how much they actually want to dedicate in relation to their revenue on the ad spend. And I feel like if you dedicate 15% of revenue to your ad spend and you're doing somewhat of a decent job, you're really hitting it in the park for them. Oh

Dylan (19:50):

Yeah. That's, that's a good little spot there. Cause I mean, I know even Zach would throw some numbers out, but I mean, he was looking at someone's where most businesses they're spending 40% of what they're making on ads, maybe,

Eric (20:02):

You know, factoring cost of goods factor in payroll factoring these ridiculous software fees, 40% an acquisition is not healthy. It's not scalable. And it's, it's why people need venture capital because they want to just throw more and more money at it. Hoping it'll get better at some point in time when the reality is Facebook is getting more expensive, um, shout out to dropshippers for it up. Uh, you know, and it's, it's getting more expensive and 40%, it doesn't make it. It's not gonna make you a lot of money and it leaves very, very little room for you to experiment with other things. And if one little thing goes wrong, suddenly you're not profitable. It's just the motivating, if anything, you know? Um, and that's why like, as, especially the DTC community, they're always talking about like increased customer lifetime value, blah blah, blah, blah, blah. That takes time. Oh, hell yeah. I'm not going to wait a year and like just bleed money until then hoping the LTV increases. Um, you really need to just figure out a way to become as efficient as you can. And you know, don't be in a rush to scale, just get the proportions right. Scaling will come and do time don't scale, um, and get a customer acquisition at all costs.

Dylan (21:20):

Now, do you have these conversations with our clients in advance to kind of help them understand what their budget is? Or is this something you kind of roll with out of the gate? Or is this something you have when you start every relationship essentially?

Eric (21:32):

Yeah. Well, I think it's, it's definitely a conversation I have with my clients and it's really up to them. Like if they want to spend everything they can to acquire customers and profit, doesn't matter to them. And in fashion and luxury that hasn't happened to me once I'll do it. If that's what they want, I'll do it. But really, I just want to go over how much their cost of goods are on average, what, you know, what their gross margins are because some people don't know, like I say, what returns you want? And they're like, uh, I don't know. Let me find out if it's a two that might make somebody happy, but it's not going to make you happy because your margins aren't high, fast fashion. You need to hit it big because you're selling products for six, seven bucks. Okay. Fair enough. It costs you a buck. You have four bucks to play with.

Dylan (22:21):

So now that Q4 is kind of coming up, I've been asking this question a lot. I love it. I think it's super juicy. We all have accounts that are going to be doubling budgets. You know, if not more, how do you help your clients plan for that? Do you have that conversation a month ago now next month, just to kind of hype them up and let them know once it's on fire, we got to feel that fire. So do you have extra cash flow? Can your inventory handling your production handle it? I'm kind of curious how you're incorporating that for the whole Q4 shenanigans that we're all about to get into.

Eric (22:52):

Yeah. So before I actually take the client on, I asked them how responsive is your supply chain and the salary? That's an important question. And it's because if we find something which hits the park and we do need to scale it, or it's like a sales season, we need to know if you can even do it. Um, I don't want to like triple your ad spend and you have to take pre-orders and they get lost somewhere because pre-orders don't work ever. Um, you know, we, we really want to find that stuff out. And as far as discussions go, um, we asked, we asked them a month ago, especially for luxury brands, black Friday, cyber Monday is coming up. I don't want you to feel pressured to go into a sale because it can damage the brand in some cases. But do you want to offer your customer something?

Eric (23:33):

And some of them will say like, hell yeah, we'll go on sale. And some of them are like, yeah, but let's just give them like 10% off. Like I call it a you discount. Like, um, and then some of them are just like, no, we don't, we don't want to acknowledge it even as a thing. Um, and that's cool. Um, I think too many sales does destroy your brand and you're going to become that brand, which is always on sale. Um, or you could be a way where you go on sale once and you completely it up. Um, which is even worse. But you know, we talked about it a month ago, so that would have been August. So we have quite a lot of leg room and then we say, okay, um, content, let's talk about it now, what content are you going to give me?

Eric (24:23):

Um, what content do you want to do? And then we'll kind of say things like, how much do you want to spend? Um, and then here's how much we suggest you spend. If you're comfortable doing it, you know, let's run it. I'm never going to suggest something which is going to make them feel uncomfortable. Like if a company's making 200 grand a month in revenue, I'm not going to say spend 500 grand on this season. It's just, um, um, it, would it make sense? Yeah. We just really just talk about the content. How are we going to deliver it? And we give them a lot of time. And the reason that is, is because if you're running a black Friday cyber Monday campaign, I'm telling you now, uh, get it in review two weeks at a time, two weeks at a time, if you're like really late as early as you can get it in review and then turn it off, um, or schedule it. Cause those review times at that time of the year are going to be ridiculous

Dylan (25:14):

And. I feel like too, I think that's a, another huge wrench in the whole fricking system.

Eric (25:20):

Oh yeah, absolutely. That's not helping at all. And you know, um, I think that political we've had, we've had it quite a lot actually. Like this ad is not political and you're saying it's political.

Dylan (25:31):

Having made a debt today. We were talking about earlier. I was like, it's not even political. We have this one brand

Eric (25:37):

Selling t-shirts to vote. And the second they release that I'm like, please don't advertise this. Um, don't like, is it political kind of, yes, no. I mean, it's not really leaning either way you can vote for anybody. I think the political thing is just the political ads don't make sense to me like the whole filter and the verifying or identity. Um, what are you going to do if I post a dirty political ad and you know who I am, I don't think Facebook's going to do anything really. It's just slowing things down. And also because of COVID, there are just not enough people to review these things, either a hundred percent of the ridiculous review times from black Friday, you have the election coming up. So you're going to have a lot of false flagging for political ads. And then you have half of Facebook's workforce, like not even being there to check and the other half doesn't know what they're doing anyway. So you've got to really just get that stuff in early plan plan, plan, plan, you know, um, and if you have brands from like Europe and the United Kingdom plan for, um, box, like the day after Christmas, that's like a big sales event. And if you have customers in China plant for singles day, um, he should have been planning for state already because that comes before black Friday and cyber Monday. Um, and single day makes way more money than black Friday.

Dylan (26:51):

I never, I learned that last year too. And I was like, I didn't know that I was so heated. Like,

Eric (26:57):

Yeah. I mean, hell yeah. Um, you know, it's, it's crazy. It makes sense in a sense like, you know, especially professional luxury, it's the Chinese people buying it anyway more than anybody.

Dylan (27:09):

Yeah. Ashton, man, they, they can train it.

Eric (27:12):

Asian people dress really cool Chinese people that have the best dress sense. So, um, I think singles is an absolutely fantastic opportunity and because Shopify sites load funny in China and you have to all do all these, sometimes you have to hire a company to get you into the market. It's that? Oh yeah. Um, you're using good. They're not even using Instagram like that. If you're not using a VPN it's bad. Um, and you know, a lot of these brands would be gone tomorrow if Instagram went. So, um, you know, you got to, if you want to get into the Chinese market and then the way you can host a single's day sale, you'll get some customers. Um, and then when you really want to expand it to China, which I think every single brand should be doing, getting into China, um, that could potentially double your income over the next few years,

Dylan (28:05):

We're going to have to have another conversation about this on the Chinese side.

Eric (28:09):

Then I had like four or five big companies come in talking about Chinese expansion and the plan and everything. And it's not cheap, but it's definitely profitable. Um, in fact, one company who's really big at it actually like bought MSN in China. Yeah. Which is huge. Yeah. But I think it's really important. I mean, it's, it's a weird statistic, but they're like 25% of global e-commerce or something stupid like that, it's it says it's crazy. Um, and they have money and uh, he should be selling where people have money. It's that simple. My God, man, this been

Dylan (28:48):

Then super juicy, super valuable, super insightful. So give everybody kind of an insight, you know, how can we help you? You know, what do you have cooking in the kitchen next? What are you looking forward to and how can people kind of get in touch with you?

Eric (29:01):

Yeah, absolutely. So, you know, I really want to make sure everything I do for my clients is fantastic work. So here's the thing we don't take. Um, just, we don't have a form on our website to kind of get in touch. We want to find people, um, and scope them out and check them out. Um, and also we only do like fashion and luxury brands. That's for two reasons. I think if you're selling an app or like a solar panel, I'm not the guy for you about either of those two things. So I don't want to advertise it, but you know, if you have a fashion and luxury brand, I think I'd be really, I think I'd probably like it. I think we could do a really good job at it and know, um, I know for a fact that we can advertise fashion and luxury better than an agency who sells everything.

Eric (29:50):

Um, so long as you pay them. Um, if you want to get in touch with me, just email me Z a R a k@diamondboost.com or you can check out our website, diamond goose.com. Um, yeah. Just connect even if you're not like a potential client or anything, you're just in the space. Like, you know, hit me up. I always like talking to people and just, you know, shooting the. So definitely, um, that's where you can kind of get, get at me right now. We're just kind of in build mode, um, really working to get our clients the best year after a terrible year of just terrible year, culturally and mentally and physically for a lot of people. Um, we just want to make sure their businesses are okay. So we want to close a year in a fantastic note. We want to bring some really cool new clients and, um, but that comes second to making what we have already working.

Eric (30:43):

Um, and that's really kind of what we're doing right now. Um, I wish I could say something more interesting, but like the fact of the matter is man, we're in advertising. It's not as cool or a rockstar thing is DTC. Twitter makes it out to be, you're a marketing guy, dude. Like that's, that's how it is. Speaking of Twitter, you'll make sure you follow him. I mean, he dropped some bombs and funny. I mean Twitter, it's some good stuff. So it makes you, it gives the Rockefeller on sweater, man. Yeah, man. It's, it's more like a posting page. It's not like a LinkedIn page. Um, uh, I'd like to call it out, has as it is. And it's not always well-received, but it's always the truth. You probably, I mean, well, I've enjoyed this one a thoroughly, man. Thank you so much for jumping on. And it was an absolute pleasure. Absolutely man. Thank you for having me on. I hope I wasn't too nervous. It's actually the first podcast, but um, absolutely loved it, man. Um, you know, um, check out funnel dash as well.

Zach (31:40):

Hell yeah. Thanks so much for listening to another episode of the rich ed or ed podcasts. If you're like me and listen to podcasts on the go, go ahead and subscribe on Apple podcasts, Spotify, YouTube and Richard [inaudible] dot com slash podcast. And if you absolutely love the show, go ahead and leave a review and a comment share with a friend. If you do take a copy screenshot of it, email me zach@funneldash.com. Show me you left a review. I'll give you a free copy of the rich and poor ed book to learn more about the book. Go to rich ed for a.com to leave a review that a rich ed for at.com/review. Thanks again.

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